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16 years ago
Tuesday, January 26, 2010
The common topics and AP courses
Now that we’ve discussed the New York Times video op-ed “Advanced Pressure,” I’d like you to identify your position on this issue. What do you think about AP courses and exams? Is there a problem with them as the video suggests? Are they good or bad for students or for their education? Is it possible to change this system or is it more practical to maintain the status quo? Once you identify your position, then choose one of the common topics (conjecture, degree, or possibility) and use this topic to sketch out all the possible lines of argument you could pursue to help you support your position about AP exam and courses. Post your response here as a comment, and we will discuss a few of these together as a class.
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ReplyDeleteAfter watching "Advanced Pressure," I agree with the movie that AP courses are not fair and they apply way too much pressure on high school students. Most students don't even take these courses for the pleasure in the material, but to gain an edge over other students and get into college. But this raises the question of is this a fair system to students? I believe that the AP system is in fact not fair. Why not just have students take the same level class? It would be easier to compare and more fair to all students. AP classes put pressure on kids to spend all hours doing homework and learning so much information that it cannot possibly all be retained. If all AP courses were diminished, it would be a more fair, and less expensive education for all students. It would be less expensive because AP tests cost money, and the more AP credits, the better a student looks to a college. Too much stress is caused by these AP courses, and for what an edge up on the competition? This has to stop, not all students have the same opportunities for education.
ReplyDeleteI guess I would have to play an impartial side in this issue. On one side, AP courses and exams can truly take its toll on students. However, on the other side, AP courses could help a student receive a scholarship to college which could reduce the costs for them to earn a degree. The video does present the problems of AP courses. They are available to be good for a students education, but the course material is covered so rapidly the students may not absorb all of the information they are learning. There are variables that are present in this argument as well. Teachers all have their own methods of covering the course layout in the set amount of time. Some have the abilities to do it properly and in a well-fashioned manner and some just stick to the outline and move at a fast rate. In my honest opinion, I think that AP courses should be removed from all schools. It is important to do well throughout high school and maintain good grades to get into college. However, with colleges only looking for the students that have enrolled in AP courses makes it difficult for students who are perfectly qualified for good colleges to get accepted.
ReplyDeleteI believe that there is definitely a problem with AP courses and how they are structured. These classes are not designed to make students thoroughly understand the topic but rather how to take a test and build a resume for college admission. The system could be changed to make it more practical but at this point these courses seem to be the only way that students can 'stick out' or prove that they are something special for the college admission process. I believe that the topic that can best persuade others of this is degree. From this you can talk about the specifics of reasons or distinctions that make AP courses very flawed on a fundamental level. They are contradictory in a way because it is not about learning a subject anymore. it becomes about the test and I believe that the topic of degree can truly emphasize and show the problems that exist for AP courses. The use of the topic of degree can outline in detail the problems and arguments presented in this situation. Is the class taught for a test or for the education of individual students? Is there too much material that cannot be adequately taught in the allotted time period? Is there too much emphasis on resume building instead of truly learning to know something?
ReplyDeleteWith so much competition in applying to college, AP courses have gone from being courses designed for extremely motivated students, to something taken just to put on an application. When originally founded as a way for honor students to receive college credit, AP courses had value and merit to them. Now, with so many students taking more and more APs, colleges do not honor the credit, and the courses loose their value. I believe the only way this system can be changed is if the Advanced Placement classes were reserved for the students that actually cared about the subject, and if students were limited to taking no more than two of them. The common topic of conjecture plays nicely into this argument as al of the solutions are hypothetical questions. The AP system is extremely flawed, and the only way to save it is to regulate it so the High Schools, Colleges , and Students are on the same page.
ReplyDeleteAfter viewing the NYT video "Advanced Pressure" I could not agree more that the AP courses offered are in the most part useless. Having taken a part in these courses throughout my highschool career I have truly say that the courses serve more as an aid towards college application than they do towards learning and fully digesting the course materials. The information required is just too much and with colleges wanting to see a more stacked schedule learning and digesting the entire material for 3 or more classes just becomes impossible and side effects that college application dont have room for such as stress and even health issues come into play. I think it is very possible to change AP for the better of the students and their learning. The IB program is just as challenging as the AP programs but it allows students to learn their subject instead of just memorizing facts for an upcoming test. Questioned to be analyzed to see if this program really is effective would be issues such as: Are students preparing for college and life ahead, or passing a test? Are we willing to compromise the quality of education for quantity?
ReplyDelete-Victor Valle
The integration of AP classes into the high school setting has achieved in my mind, its purpose of preparing kids for college, maybe not it its content but definitely in its quantity. The high rigor and work load associated with AP courses forces students to develop efficient study habits and work ethics that are greatly beneficial in the adjustment to college life. However this knowledge can be achieved from just one or two AP classes and does not require the student to load themselves up with four or five college level classes as a high school student. So in a personal and developmental sense AP classes have the potential to be worthwhile and effective in their purpose to prepare students for college. They do not achieve this in their ability to teach students the material though. Many of the classes go too quickly or cover too much information for students to really grasp what it was that they are supposed to be learning. So as much help as they are in promoting effectiveness and efficiency, the classes lose their appeal as adequate conveyers of necessary knowledge and information. Administration within high schools has really taken to AP, as have colleges, creating an increasing demand for AP courses to be taught and taken. Since 2009 even the encouragement to be enrolled in AP classes has soared showing an upward trend. AP is a “hot” item in high school right now and trying to change it or get rid of the program all together is going to be incredibly difficult.
ReplyDeletePossibility: The question of possibility resides in the potential way to change, modify, or eradicate AP classes in high schools. As I already mentioned undertaking any of these actions, especially abolition of the system, is going to be exceptionally difficult. One argument that could be made is to limit the number of courses that individual students can take per year or semester. This way the students would still receive the life skills of time management and planning while not being overloaded with too much work. If given the time students may be able to digest the information thrown at the more by spending more time really understanding the material which would help them to learn versus just regurgitate. Many people have suggested that taking AP classes has become too regimented so that kids do not take classes that interest them, but by limiting the number each student can take; they will be forced to choose the classes and/or subjects that they are the most interested in. The only contention here would be to communicate the need for the limit with colleges so that they see two classes as being the full advantage to which students can use their AP resources. The possibility of this exists; it is just a matter of convincing individuals that this course of action with be the most beneficial solution to the AP situation.
Advanced Placement, or AP, is the standard by which contemporary high schools are run. In its inception, AP was intended to be an opportunity to learn at a more advanced level and gain more experience before college. The lure of potential college credit was meant to help give students a step ahead. But now that extra boost on a résumé is expected of college bound high school students. Egged on by college counselors and parents, students sign theirs lives away to the herculean task of too many AP classes. Students are asked to overtax themselves, constantly stressing over those ominous tests around the corner in May. There is a problem with AP, not in its existence, but rather in the monster it has become. It has morphed into a domineering force overshadowing high school students, but the truth is that AP is inherently good. The problem, I believe, is that AP has become a runaway train, become too much of a good thing, and in the process, it has jumped the tracks.
ReplyDeleteAP exam classes are optional classes that junior and seniors high school students might want to take one or two a year to develop skills that will help them in their future as a college students. The students that take more than two classes a year are more likely taking those classes just to have credits for college and not the intention of learning. So instead of paying 40 thousand dollars a year on classes, students pay only 500 dollars to get the credits for the college courses. This is very logical and acceptable, so the problem is not with the AP classes but with how students use them. AP classes were made to practice high school students to college life and what most courses in college would feel like, so AP classes are good for that reason but educationally they are not very effective. In order to change the system of these classes it will take a long time and its more likely not to happen but on the long run modifications might be added to the AP system like students are not allowed to take more than two or three classes a year, or even by decreasing the quantity of the course and giving more education. For example instead of taking a whole college course that is taken in college in three quarters or two semesters, teachers should teach only half the course so students still will be definitely be challenged and they will learn more the material. Another thing that could be fixed or modified in the AP system is limit the amount of credits that students can transfer to college so students will take the classes because they actually interested in it and not have to.
ReplyDeleteAP courses promote quantity over quality. Students are asked to memorize large amounts of information all in the name of a test. As a person who took AP exams in high school, I can recall instances of students getting excited about the idea of burning their books the moment the dreaded exam was completed. I can also recall the competitive atmosphere AP courses created; some of my friends would questions whether or not they would get into a coveted college after hearing that another person in our graduating class was taking five AP courses instead of two. Students are put in schools to learn, but society has embedded a systematic mission in the minds of high school students: memorize material, take a test, and shave some money off college tuition. Students are being asked to cram the equivalent of three college semesters into one high school course. Because of AP exams, people in high school care more about how many courses they can take in order to boost their resume rather than the reward of learning interesting material.
ReplyDeleteI like the idea that AP is giving students an opportunity to accell, but due to the testimonies given by students and teachers they are only being accelerated into the ground. My own AP class had me in the mindset like "okay I can tackle this, this won't take me down", when it should have been "alright this won't be easy but I'm ready to learn!" The AP organization does nothing to forward this message, from the principals, teachers, counsilors and colleges they give the message to take AP courses or you won't reach the same level of success as those who do. But these who do, on some occasions attain unhealthy lifestyles for the "test's" sake, and sometimes when they reach the end there's is no college credit to replenish their worn out minds.
ReplyDeleteEven teachers have spoken out and revealed the dark sides of their own AP courses. It is also true that colleges sometimes refuse to ackowledge the pre-collegiate work students put in. Is this for the money or the level of learning for the students?
Students develop unhealthy lifestyles, because AP isn't all that there is going on in the lives of the students but they still would like thoes "five points" so relentless efforts to achieve drives them into the middle of the night.
AP needs to review their curriculum.
I agree with the movie. I believe that AP courses and exams have become strictly a competitive decision. The idea of taking an advanced placement class is no longer relevant to the passion to learn and absorb interesting and crucial information. It is now revolving around the building and buffing of college application, and succeeding beyond your peers. I believe the problem the movie is suggesting is valid, yet I think it is exaggerated. I think the students who do take AP credits do have a heavy course load, but most students, due to lack of passion to learn, do not fulfill all of the course load’s requirements. They are simply taking the class for their college applications and the “looks” of it, rather than taking the workload seriously, the take the class for any grade, not always an A. I think this is bad for students and education. It encourages false motives to take such courses. I don’t think it is realistic, but I think it IS idealistic to change the system. Perhaps, like the clip suggested, illuminate AP courses, or create all high school courses at such a level. This way the want to take the “harder” classes will be less desired because everyone’s courses will be equal. It has become a yearning to ace a test rather than absorbing information. It has become a task to cram as many AP courses in high school career to build their resume, rather than take classes of interest and meaning. Is this how we want our children to think of education? Where will this bring us in the future?
ReplyDeleteThere are not many problems with AP courses. The issue at hand is between making healthy choices and getting college credit. The fault falls on two groups, universities and students. Students should be aware of their limits and how much they can handle before breaking down mentally and physically, while Universities should be aware that a student entering with AP credit is not at all likely to pursue the class further unless forced to take a follow up course (as the video would suggest). When I was in high school I decided to take AP History only because I loved US History, not because I was after college credit, I wasn't aware that I could get college credit for it until half way through the year anyway. Students should only enlist in AP classes that they feel passionate about. The simplest way to remove the flaw tied to AP courses would be not to limit the amount that can be taken but rather by revoking the credit you get for the class in college. The incentive is still there, students are granted a GPA bump for taking the class, however the need to overload the schedule with them to gain admittance to a college is removed.
ReplyDeleteIn the New York Times video called “Advanced Pressure,” people begin to see the negatives of having kids stack their schedule with college level courses, while still in their high school years. The question then arises, is it possible to change this system or is it more practical to maintain the status quo? With a past experience of the stress that AP level courses bring, I have experienced the nights where staying up until 2 a.m. become necessary. I feel as though these courses gave me the wrong impression of college. My work load seems to be much lighter. This is mainly due to the fact that more time is reserved in college for homework rather than sitting in class 7 hours per day. People tend to forget the jam-packed schedules of high school students between, classes, homework, and practices (many high school students are athletes). Something needs, and can be done in order to change this system for the better. What needs to be done is simple; high school level courses cannot count towards college credit. The fact that many students want to challenge themselves by taking harder courses in wonderful, but with this AP test at the end of the year deciding whether or not you will receive college credit seems rather unfair to the student. Without this burden on the teacher of making sure his/her students will do well on the exam in order to gain the college credit they seek for, pressure builds, driving the teacher to inject quantity rather than quality into the students. If this end of the year qualification test is eliminated, relief will be granted to the teacher as he/she will no longer feel that all the course material in necessary, and can spend more time on certain subjects, making sure the students learn the material rather than memorize it, just to see it forgotten after the final exam.
ReplyDelete